All the tweaks and fixes DMC4 Dante desperately needs

EDIT 30-04-2015: Added/changed a few lines to Gilgamesh, Lucifer, Pandora and Royalguard. Thanks to cdudeachyut and SBK91 for contributions.

EDIT 05-05-2015: More changes added to nearly every single element in the list, fixed some typos and descriptions for clarity, removed a couple lines. All changes are marked with brackets.

This is my list of suggested fixes, tweaks and changes to DMC4 Dante's movelist. I could've written this list 7 years ago, but I didn't. Now with a Special Edition just around the corner, I feel it's time to mention all the things Capcom is most likely not going to – for lack of a better word – repair, in this incarnation of Dante.

I'd like to think I covered everything in this list, but it's easy to miss a thing or two, however obvious they may seem. Please let me know if there are any relevant changes you would like to see included in this list.

I must also ask of everyone who supports this list to leave a comment of some kind, perhaps in the form of a signature, and share it with everyone who might be interested. Who knows, maybe Capcom will notice if it gets high enough exposure.

(In other words like shayurrr & susbCRYYYYY!!!)

Rebellion

• Round Trip
  • Reduce/remove windup frames
  • Increase attack duration (to 5 seconds)
  • Allow charging while holding other weapons
  • Reduce damage a bit
  • Improve accuracy for all directions
  • Allow lock-on to determine which target is affected
  • Allow sword to fly over to other enemies upon killing locked-on target
  • [Allow the Melee attack [or Style button with Swordmaster equipped] to be used for hand-to-hand attacks i.e. Thrust Kick, one-hit Kick13, dive kick, etc. (or something new)]

• Quick Drive
  • Give it enemy-launching properties
  • Change the input to Hold Melee button from the first ground slash (Like in the DMC3 demo)

• Helm Breaker
  • [Remove knockdown from the first hit. This change is made with the inclusion of The Hammer for Gilgamesh in mind.]

• Dance Macabre
  • Allow the dash to be canceled out of
  • Give the dash launching properties when hitting already launched enemies
  • Increase vertical range of the dash so it's easier to hit targets above Dante
  • Bring back Crazy Dance (from DMC3)
  • Make every hit fatal to enemies

• Bring back Air Raid (DMC1-3) with Lock-on + Jump as the input (must be pushed at the same time, rather than holding then pressing the other). Allows Dante to use his wings and fly around. Can use guns while flying, Jealousy (Pandora) can be extended for the duration of the flight. Melee attack button performs Vortex. Can be upgraded to Vortex lvl 2. Pressing the Jump button either performs an Air Hike (if available) or allows Dante to drop. Style button still performs Style actions as normal, canceling him out of Air Raid.

Gilgamesh

• Combo A
  • Shorten start up frames of the finisher when uncharged
• Combo B
  • Widen the range of the finisher
  • Multikicks
    • Make multikicks cancelable
    • Bring back Hyperfist (from DMC3) to the multikicks. Alternatively, allow the multikicks to be extended
    • Increase the number of kicks when charged depending on charge level
    • Reduce overall damage of charged multikicks
    • [Kick13: Replace Just Frame Charge Level 1 and 2 with Kick13 and DT Kick 13 (can be done while unDT'd) respectively, move Rising Sun to its own Melee button back input]

• (DT) Kick13
  • [Bind to Melee + Style buttons with Swordmaster equipped]
  • [Alternatively: Move to Combo B finisher (read above changes)]

• Allow Dante to adjust direction when not holding the lock-on button
• [Allow Dante to automatically veer towards the closest enemy when not locked-on to anything]
• [Allow Dante to automatically veer towards locked-on enemy if he's somehow facing away, or the enemy moves away]
• Allow (DT) Kick 13 to be canceled out of after every non-finisher
• Reduce overall damage a bit
• Increase launching strength of the launcher kick, sending launched enemies higher

• Draw / Straight
  • Move to Melee button forward input (read Kick13 changes)
  • Remove Draw
  • When DT'd, Straight is replaced with Hyperfist, except when already charging
  • Replace the Melee button back input with Rising Sun

• Rising Sun
  • One of three choices:
    a. Move to the Melee back input (read Draw / Straight changes)
    b. Let it stay where it is (at the end of DT Kick13)
  • If. a):
    • Add charging levels 1 & 2

• Charge Level 2 adds a third kick
• Just Frame Charge Level 1 adds a third kick
• Just Frame Charge Level 2 adds a third and fourth kick
• Re-balance overall damage

• Full House
  • Rename to Killer Bee. (Yes, I'm serious. C'mon, guys.)
  • Allow angle to adjust according to locked-on target's distance
  • Gradually increase falling speed when longer in the air

• Flush
  • Lengthen duration of flames beyond the jumping animation if not canceled out of
  • Slightly increase overall range
  • Add Melee attack properties so it can be used to parry/clash attacks with
  • [Allow Flush to appear when jumping immediately after switching to Gilgamesh without having to wait for Dante's appearance to update]

• Beast Uppercut / Rising Dragon / Divine Dragon
  • One of two choices:
    a. Move to the Back Melee button input (and let Rising Sun stay in DT Kick13)
    b. Remove altogether. (and move Rising Sun to Melee button input, read Draw/Straight changes)
    c. Replace with Shock. (and move Rising Sun to Melee button input, read Draw/Straight changes)
  • If a.):
    • Allow Rising Dragon to be performed with a second press of the Melee attack button before the uppercut comes out (Like in DMC3)
    • Charge levels and Just Charges of Beast Uppercut:
      • Increase in damage
      • Dante quickly slides forward (Similar to Magma Drive from DMC1) depending on charge level, this can be used to further avoid medium/high attacks as he lowers his hitbox
      • After charging, Dante can slightly adjust the direction of his punch left or right after releasing the button, this improves accuracy and success rate when locked-on to a target somewhat in front of Dante and also allows the player to deviate left or right a bit with the analog stick.
      • Just Frame Charges increase the speed at which Dante moves and boost damage a bit.
      • After charging, a second press of the Melee button cancels Beast Uppercut into Rising Dragon. Divine Dragon is a fully charged Rising Dragon.
      • Just Frame Charges drastically increase the overall speed & number of hits of Rising/Divine Dragon

• If b.): Read Shock changes below

• Shock
  • Change input to Forward Style button (read Beast Uppercut / Rising Dragon / Divine Dragon changes)
  • Increase the overall radius and range of every level of Charge and Just Charge to better represent the larger explosions
  • Slightly reduce recovery frames after successfully performing a Just Frame Charge
  • Just Frame Charge Level 2 creates an additional low-damage shockwave that launches all enemies close to Dante, though it'd most likely kill DMD Scarecrows and any enemy with similar health values.
  • With the Style button on its own, Dante then performs a projectile similar to Zodiac/Meteor (DMC1/3) on the ground, and The Hammer (DMC3) in the air. (Read their respective details below)

• Shocking!
  • Reduce start up frames a bit
  • Increase range of the explosion depending on the height from which Dante falls
    • Up to double jump height = uncharged explosion damage with the range of a Charge Level 1
    • From double jump height to the equivalent height of four jumps = Charge Level 2 explosion with less damage output
    • Any higher than the equivalent of four jumps = Just Frame Charge Level 2 explosion with less damage output

• Zodiac/Meteor (projectile fireball)
  • Bind to Style button (read Shock / Shocking! details above) Depending on the graphic, either name works.
  • Can be charged by holding the button, has Level 1 & 2 Charges, as well as Just Frame variations.

• Uncharged: Small projectile, infinite range, travels as fast as a Drive, low damage (about as much as a Hatred shot). Dante recovers as quickly as he did in DMC3.
• Charge Level 1: Slightly larger projectile, deals 1.5x damage.
• Just Frame Charge Level 1: Deals 2.0x damage, can pierce through and hit multiple enemies, travels faster, Dante recovers more quickly. If button is pressed again in time with the shot, Dante can fire up to two more projectiles, each one dealing 1.7x damage.
• Charge Level 2: Twice as large projectile, deals 2.0x damage, explodes on impact, hitting multiple targets.
• Just Frame Charge Level 2: Deals 3.0x damage, can pierce through and hit multiple enemies, travels even faster, Dante recovers more quickly, can be extended with timed button presses up to 2 additional shots at 2.0 damage each, and every enemy hit by the fireball will detonate a couple of seconds later at 1.7x damage. The explosion can hit multiple targets but has smaller range.
• Every explosion/detonation has the same knock back strength as a Stinger.

• The Hammer (aerial knock down punch from DMC3)
  • Bind to Style button in the air (read Shock / Shocking! details above)
  • Reduce output damage
  • Knocked down enemy bounces right back up
  • When DT'd, knocked down enemy causes a shockwave to knock back nearby enemies

• Real Impact
  • Bring back Tornado (from DMC3)

Lucifer

• [Any blades left floating in the air will be ready to explode, so any enemy that comes into contact with them will suffer a normal hit (as opposed to being pinned without hitstun. Does not affect blades pinned into enemies.]

• Combo A-E

• Shorten frames between the first and second attack of the ground combo
• Add more attack combo variations when delaying button presses
• Reduce delay required between button presses

• Ecstasy

• Allow thrown rose to persist after switching to a different Devil Arm

• Splash
  • Reduce recovery frames

• Discipline & Bondage
  • Remove delay between releasing the button and blades flying into position
  • Increase speed at which the blades fly towards enemies
  • [Both formations summon all 15 blades by default]

• Climax
  • Increase/double the time the blades are allowed to stay before automatically detonating
  • [Summons all 15 blades]

Ebony & Ivory

• Normal/Air Shot

• Remove delay between the first button press and the first gunshot when already locked-on
• Bring back Wild Stomp (from DMC3)

• Charge Shot
  • When already charged or shooting, allow Twosome Time / Honey Comb Fire / Rainstorm to use Charged Shots

• Twosome Time
  • [Remove startup frames when canceling other moves]
  • Remove automatic aim
  • Remove recovery frames
  • Improve cancellation when used in between melee attacks

Coyote-A Shotgun

• Normal/Air Shot
  • Remove delay between the first button press and the first gunshot when already locked-on
  • Reduce recovery frames as to improve cancellation into other moves
• Charge Shot
  • When already charged or shooting, allow (Air) Fireworks / Gunstinger / Backslide to use Charged Shots
• (Air) Fireworks
  • Improve accuracy and range
  • Reduce recovery frames
  • Allow the ability to extend number of shots by tapping the button

• Backslide
  • Improve overall accuracy and range

• Gunstinger
  • Slightly reduce recovery frames
  • Bring back Point Blank (from DMC3)

Pandora

• [Increase amount of Disaster gauge gained from every non-Gunslinger shot]

• Omen
  • Allow start-up animation to be canceled out of

• Grief
  • Allow Dante to move freely, but won't be able to use Pandora again until it returns
  • Grief will continue until the Disaster gauge has depleted
  • [Can be used in the air]

• Argument
  • [Make the whole startup animation cancelable.] (honestly I'd rather remove it and just bring back Air Raid)

Trickster

• Allow Double and Triple Dashing
• Improve area of contact for triggering Mustang on smaller enemies
• Bring back Wall Hike (wall running from DMC3)
  • [Allow Dante to run along as many walls and other vertical surfaces as possible]

Royalguard

• Increase amount of Rage gained from Royal Blocks (aka Just Guards)
• Increase damage output when the Rage meter is completely full
• Allow Block to cancel Dante out of side-rolls
• Make the graphical and sound effects for Royal Blocks to be brighter, louder, and overall look and feel more rewarding to perform.
• [Regular enemies are stunned when their melee attacks are Just Guarded, except when DT'd]
• [Allow Dante to always pierce through small/regular enemies/targets with Royal Releases (aka Just Releases)]

Dark Slayer

• Slash Dimension C/F
  • Allow the start-up animation to be canceled out of after the back-step and before the actual attack
  • [Merge both into a single Style button + Back attack input that adapts to the distance of locked-on target without increasing maximum range]
  • [Replace the Forward input with a different attack. What kind of attack is entirely up for debate and open to suggestions. There's just no reason for two Slash Dimensions.]
    • [Suggested replacement: Sword Pierce (from DMC3) with Yamato.]

• [Sword Pierce]
  • [Dante throws Yamato at a locked-on target and it sticks to most enemies.]
    • [Deals as much damage and knockback impact as Rebellion Stinger.]
    • [While stuck to an enemy, it drills and inflicts minor damage, hitting once every second.]
    • [After 10 hits, it automatically returns.]
    • [If it kills the enemy it's pinned to, Yamato automatically returns to Dante.]
    • [If the initial thrust kills the enemy, Yamato automatically pins to the nearest enemy.]
    • [If the initial thrust doesn't hit an enemy that can be pinned, then it immediately returns to Dante.]
    • [While returning, Yamato pierces through enemies in its path.]
  • [Enemies it does not stick to:]
    • [Shielded Bianco/Alto Angelo, armored Blitz, cloaked Faust, Cutlasses while swimming, Frosts while teleporting, Faults, Berial, Bael/Dagon, Echidna, shielded Angelo Credo, Doppelganger Dante]

• [While DT'd, Yamato it will pierce through all enemies in the area]
• [If already stuck to an enemy, Yamato hits faster when DT'd.]

• Aerial Rave V
  • Slightly reduce startup frames
  • Slightly reduce height lost when jump canceling

Other changes/features

• Have Enemy Step by default
• Have Speed by default
• Have a running Taunt
  • Suggested running Taunt: A kick that launches enemies into the air
• Improve cancellation of all taunts
• Improve Style meter gain of all taunts
• Bring back Free Ride, allowing Dante to land on a downed enemy i.e. Scarecrows, Assaults, de-cloaked Mephistos/Fausts, etc. and ride it like a skateboard (from DMC3).
  • Suggested new Free Ride features:
    • Shooting the Shotgun performs Fireworks while spinning around, knocking back every enemy hit
    • Can taunt while riding
    • Can slice enemies with Rebellion while riding
    • Can charge & perform Shock while riding
    • Can shoot Lucifer blades in all directions while spinning with Climax

DMC4 Red Queen Revving for 14 minutes

It's been, what, four weeks I missed? Five?

Sorry guys, but I just haven't had the time nor disposition to work on new material. It's either too busy with work, or too busy doing other things that bring me income (writing) or gaming. I've got to prioritize and do the stuff that really matters to me now.

That said, I'm reuploading three fight requests in HD and 60fps for your viewing pleasure. Consider the channel's ability to push out new content every week on hiatus. I dunno when I'll be able to do more new things.

For now, enjoy these!

Ever seen a Triforce made of Metroids?

legend of zelda metroid prime triforce link

What's the most important aspect in a DMC title for you?

Click the link to vote in the poll:
http://strawpoll.me/3280105

I made a very similar poll to this one a couple years ago (on gfaqs), and I was surprised with the results.

Well, it's been after a failed reboot, and we're seeing DMC4SE around the corner, so I'm curious

to see the results now. I'll expand a little on each option.

1. Fairly straightforward, this is how you control the character, and what you can do. It also

takes into consideration weapon design as not just how it plays, but also how it looks.

2. This might be the most complex one of the group, but I think it makes sense to put it enemy

and boss designs and behaviors paired together with the combat. In other words, this point

implies that it's not the variety in what you can do that matters, but the options you're given

in combat given how enemies and bosses behave, and the level of depth in the strategy it takes to

defeat them (preferably in more ways than one).

3. Self-explanatory, but to be clearer, "consistency with the storyline" means how the plot and

characters tie-in with the overall narrative and themes of the storyline, as well as any

noteworthy plot-holes. (i.e. Vergil choosing to stay in hell as opposed to being taken by

demons/Mundus, Nero being a descendant of Sparda with no logical explanation given, DMC2 Dante

being seemingly a stoic loner, etc.)

4. These two should go together because a game's soundtrack needs to compliment the level design

perfectly, not to mention when it changes gear with the combat.

5. Just... just.. sigh. Since DMC3 that this has somehow become a staple in the series and was

thus carried over to DMC4. Personally I think this element of over-the-top-craziness-regardless-

of-anything is the worst thing to have happened to the series, even though it was probably

injected into the younger Dante's story arc to contrast heavily with DMC2's more constrained

persona. But the fact of the matter remains: original Dante acted like neither, not even close,

and there's no reason for Dante to act in the way he does in DMC4.

6. One aspect is just as important as the next, and a perfect balance is necessary. I don't know

how anyone can genuinely pick this one because there hasn't been a single DMC with perfect

execution; not even the first one (plot, dialogue, presentation etc. could've been better). I

guess you can count on wishful thinking to vote this.

7. Did I forget something? Then tell the rest of the class.

Devil May Cry 4 Special Edition - Vergil?

http://www.capcom.co.jp/devil4se/

In case you haven't watched the teaser yet, DMC4 is finally getting a Special Edition, over 7 years after the fact.

Guys, I have one central question to this reveal:

Are they going to fix anything?

Or in other words, are they going to finally release the completed, supposedly originally intended game?

Look, to understand where I'm coming from, here's a summary of my history with DMC4:

I bought it on release date for the PS3 back in 2008, and like many other DMC3 players, I was disappointed. In short, we all felt like it was an unrefined, unfinished version of the game that could've been. I hated the story and the characters, I hated how whole 20 missions thing was laid out between Nero and Dante and most importantly, I was split between disappointed and hateful with many of the changes, features and nerfing Dante got.

So now we're presented with the reveal that a Special Edition is coming with Vergil in it. We don't know if he's going to be playable yet, but I think it's fair to assume that he will. Otherwise, what's the point?

In truth, DMC4 doesn't need Vergil. It never did. What it always needed was to be either completed, or at the very least, fixed through patches, but they never came to pass. The PC port didn't address any of the problems the game originally had, they just added the Turbo setting and Legendary Dark Knight mode.

I won't go into heavy detail about every single little thing they should've fixed, but the bottom line is this: they only had ONE job, and that was to give DMC3 Dante the ability to switch Styles on the fly. That's it.

But instead, they copied only a portion of his moves, forced heavy nerfs on some of them, and senselessly remapped some of those moves. Only Rebellion was greatly improved, and even then they messed up Round Trip tremendously.

So again I ask the central question: are they going to fix anything?

The teaser is just a picture of Vergil behind the DMC4 logo with the Special Edition subtitle, with Daniel Southworth's voice over it, whom is the original voice actor, and he says “I need more power!”

Two things to note.

1 - Vergil isn't moving.
It is literally just a picture, and I think it just looks like a re-render of his DMC3 model. Not the one from the CGI promotional pictures, though. His in-game model. I think this is the case because of his hair. In the original DMC3 CGI picture, all of his hair is slicked back or spiky, with a clear hairline showing.

In the DMC4SE teaser, you can see short little hair strands hanging over his forehead, and that's what Vergil looks like in DMC3, both in the cutscenes and in-game. The sleeves look the same, the collar looks the same, the back seems to look the same, and the only thing that's different in the design is the straps on the shoulders. I can't decide if it's good or bad that he looks nearly identical, personally I would say they could redesign him a bit more but I'll let you decide. Though I obviously wouldn't mind if he looked exactly the same, there's nothing fundamentally wrong with the original design.

The point is, either way, it doesn't seem like they put any effort whatsoever in this teaser. It's just a picture of a cheap re-render, I think, and it should've at least been minimally animated. Even what little you can see of Yamato looks wrong, it's too dull and flat.

2 – The line sounds like it was re-recorded.

Basically it means they put Daniel into a sound booth and got him to record new lines for the game. But I don't know what else to infer from it because nothing else is specified in the teaser. At any case, the line is taken directly from DMC3's plot. And apparently now it's his only character trait?

But let's think about this for a second. There are a few possibilities:

a) He's going to be playable, and nothing more.

If this is true, it means he won't have any relevance to the game's plot, we won't have cutscenes, etc. and he'll be there just as a playable character. The recorded line will serve as a taunt or whatever.

b) There will be new cutscenes with him.

One of the main problems with the plot in DMC4 is that it provides no insight on what happened to Vergil after DMC1. All we learn is that living armours (Bianco and Alto Angelo) were crafted from pieces of Nelo Angelo's armour and that Yamato was found broken. Later, Nero has kind of a Devil Trigger awakening – similar to Dante's in DMC3 – while angrily quoting Vergil on the “more power” thing, and this awakening somehow repairs Yamato and brings it to his hand.

The novels don't count, sorry.

But anyway, cutscenes with Vergil can mean he will be playable too, or maybe he will be a boss character that Dante has to fight as some point.

c) Prologue!

Like with DMC3 SE, DMC4SE might have Vergil playable on all 20 missions with only a couple pre-main-plot cutscenes when you go into mission 1, and that'll be it. This would be... acceptable, I guess.

d) Full campaign.

It's just not going to happen, is it? Everyone can agree that the original DMC4 came with a very awkward campaign, with Nero taking 13 missions while Dante took 7 very crappy missions. They're the worst missions in the game, and I'm pretty sure they were supposed to have their own separate campaigns.

So, finally, even though it's HIGHLY unlikely, Vergil might get his own campaign, with his own cutscenes and his own set of missions, but if this turns out to be the case, it's going to make everyone feel cheated that the other two characters remain in that awful state.

Well, I think I've gone on long enough, so I'll just leave the central question again at the end.

Will CAPCOM fix any of the problems with DMC4 in the Special Edition?

1,000 SUBSCRIBERS? SHIN AKUMA SUPERPLAY!

In fairness, it was only suggested by one subscriber, but I found that it would be a nice enough treat for everybody to see this. There's some more detail in the description of the video so go check it out!

What's next? I haven't decided quite yet. Technically I should either finish, or restart the 3S Necro Superplay I didn't complete way back. But I'm not feeling it, to tell you the truth.